0:49

Welcome back to Music Ghost Stories. I'm your host, Donnie, and today we embark on a conversation that lives right at the intersection of music, creativity, and the unexpected turns that a life devoted to sound can take You know, there are moments when music finds you before you even realize that you were looking for it. A song shared at just the right time, an instrument that speaks a language you didn't know you understood. A video posted on the corner of the internet that somehow reaches millions of people and changes everything Today's guest is Andy McKee. If you spent any time in the world of acoustic guitar, chances are you've encountered his music. His fingerstyle compositions have moved through the world with a force, connecting with people in ways that are hard to explain, yet really easy to feel. We're gonna talk about how music shaped his path, what it means to create something and send it out into the world, and what synchronicity looks like when you're living it. This is Music Ghost Stories. Let's dive in.

Donny 2:06

Great, Andy, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for joining us.

Andy 2:08

Thank you for having me.

Donny 2:10

Tell a little bit about yourself and maybe some of your accomplishments that you're proud of.

Andy 2:14

I am, uh, Andy McKee. I am A finger style guitar player. I write instrumental guitar music, I put some videos on YouTube about 20 years ago now, They were some of the first sort of viral videos, I had no expectations of what those videos might do. It was just a brand new website back then, you know. they really kind of launched my career in a big way I tour, all over the world, I got to tour with Prince, in 2012 he saw me on YouTube and so he invited me to go on tour with him and, I got to open for a band called Dream Theater, one of my favorite progressive rock bands, I've got to meet all my guitar heroes and play with them it's been a pretty wild life, it really, took off like I never would've imagined, to the level that it did. I'm very grateful for it. So, Thanks for having me on your show, by the way.

Donny 2:55

I just checked the Candy Rat video. 61 million views on Candy Rat right now.

Andy 3:01

For drifting.

Donny 3:02

Yes. And I was 1 million of them because in high school I, thought it'd be really, challenging to. Learn, drifting, So, yeah, drifting on YouTube is where I discovered Andy, how odd is that, that that could be such a big trajectory for a career,

Andy 3:21

yeah, man. It really took me by surprise I didn't know how I was gonna have a career with music. From here in Kansas. I still live here, but, you know, I thought maybe my wife would have a decent job and everything would work out I could teach guitar lessons at a guitar store or something, but, I had inspirations like Michael Hedges, you know, and Preston Reed and Don Ross, guys that really made me want to get into this style. And this kind of solo acoustic guitar thing just really resonated with me so much.

Donny 3:45

What was the moment that you'd say you became attached to the instrument or music in general?

Andy 3:52

I think with music in general, I really. Felt it. I think it is kind of a, a funny piece of music. Maybe some people might hear it and laugh a bit, but it was the soundtrack to the movie Rocky Four of All Things. There's this instrumental music in that, soundtrack that. Just blew me away, you know? I was like six or seven years old Rocky's training out in Siberia to do this boxing match with Ivan Drago, he's got all this kind of primitive training equipment running up a snowy mountain and. But the music, just, I, I remember it as clear as day. I was just so moved by it. And it's this composer, Vince is his name. And, I wanted that soundtrack, so, that was my first cassette tape I ever owned and just used to listen to it all the time for, his instrumental pieces that were on there. what was so powerful about it was that there were no words. I felt like I had this really powerful connection with music and it was instrumental. So I've always loved instrumental music since I was a little kid. That was my first, real powerful connection with music But I never really thought about playing an instrument, till, a few years later and I thought I might try playing the drums and my mom rented me a drum kit, but, that didn't really stick and I didn't have any lessons or anything. When I was 12 years old though, I heard Eric Johnson on the radio and that was really with the guitar. I was like. Man, I wanna play the guitar after hearing that. And, and again, it was instrumental music. It was his tune clips of Dover, on the radio. So this is about 1991. I heard that and. Was just so moved, you know, again, with just this instrumental music, like how is music this powerful, you know, there's no words telling me anything, but I'm like seeing a whole story or I'm painting a picture with this music and it's so evocative and, emotional to me, you know? So I wanted a guitar so that, my 13th birthday, my dad got me my first guitar, so that was. How I got started with it

Donny 5:42

when you. Had that soundtrack, did you always imagine the movie or did it change at one point?

Andy 5:49

No, you know, I, felt like I kind of, re ascribed it to my own life, in whatever. I was going through maybe I've found that with instrumental music when it doesn't necessarily have a story of its own. You can paint whatever picture you want or tell whatever kind of story in your head like it was a soundtrack to my own life or that day

Donny 6:07

your dad bought you. Your first guitar. did your dad know instruments or did he just go grab you something quick?

Andy 6:14

Yeah, he just went and grabbed me something. My mom had actually got him a guitar. Well before I was born, he never played it at all. He didn't play guitar at all, so, my family was totally non-musical. Really?

Donny 6:24

Was sports his thing or something?

Andy 6:26

Yeah. Actually he was, way more athletic. Yeah, I'm actually quite short and so was my dad. I think he was five, seven or so, just like me. But he was really good at basketball and, uh, gymnastics and track and field, all that kind of stuff. I was the complete opposite. I didn't like sports at all growing up, but my dad would, sign me up for soccer and baseball and basketball and all those types of things. But I didn't really like competing so much. I'm not a very competitive person. I don't like. Feeling like I'm pitted against other people I like to cooperate more. I'm more of that kind of vibe, I guess, or I like to go off on my own, you know, and just do my own thing. So maybe that's part of why I'm a solo guitar player. He was a bit more athletic rather than musically inclined, but he definitely loved listening to music. He had so many records, like crates full of records. I remember hearing him, listening to stuff growing up, all kinds of Rolling Stones, Fleetwood Mac the Beatles, and Pink Floyd.

Donny 7:12

A very, pivotal part of your story is having that instrument in your hands. I kind of wanna talk about your sister and your cousin tell me about them,

Andy 7:23

yeah, so I have an older sister, Shortly after I got into really listening to music I remember finding like these VHS cassettes where she had been taping like MTV it had like all these videos, and I remember seeing like Iron Maiden on there and Motley Crew and I got really into that kind of stuff, as a young kid, when I first got into playing guitar, you know, I thought Eric Johnson was like, the Apex and, discovered Joe Satriani and other guys, along those lines. I was kind of into all this Hard rock stuff and I had this older sister still, you know, and she was going to bars and things, and she was like, Hey, do you want to come to the bar? And so I would sneak into these bars and I, meet these bands I got to go up and like, play a couple times at these bars Yeah, I was like 14. I was playing Inner Sandman with these rock bands in town. It was pretty fun, man. I was like, this is totally what I want to do with the rest of my life, you know? This is so cool. I finally felt like I was a cool kid or something, you know? It was a lot of fun, man. I had this older cousin and he had, moved back here to Kansas and he started going to the university here, and they had these guitar classes and so they were teaching some classical guitar a bit. we would actually work on some of these Bach duet type things and he'd show me some classical guitar. He was a really incredible, and he still is. He lives out in Nashville now, but he doesn't work professionally as a musician or anything, but he's a really great guitar player. He was like Van Halen, he really could play all that stuff and had the tone down he would teach me awesome Van Halen tunes and licks and also these classical guitar things. I was just like learning so much from him and he was such a great. Influence and inspiration there, to learn new things. And he also, he was a really a collector too. He had this sort of OCD collector sort of personality. He had like 300 guitar magazines that he just gave to me that he had collected over the years. you could open up one of these issues of Guitar World and there'd be like three different songs transcribed you could, you know, learn a, a Motley Crue song and an extreme song and a, you know, whatever, maybe a, a lick from a dream theater song. But then There'd also be, lessons from Buckethead or Joe Satriani, you know, it was just incredible. So I was learning so much stuff out of there too. One of the really big things, that was pivotal for me, in particular with my cousin is, he took me to go see Preston Reed, when I was 16. He was coming to town, he was doing a, uh, a sort of guitar workshop on behalf of Washburn Guitars at that time. My cousin, Richard, said, Hey man, do you want to go see this guitar player? He sounds like he's pretty interesting. I said, sure. And so, we went and saw him and it was Preston Reed and I was just, absolutely changed, you know, after that night. He was playing, acoustic finger style guitar, but he was using Altered Tunings and doing percussion on the guitar and playing over the top of the guitar neck and tapping and slap harmonics and stuff that I didn't even know you could do on an acoustic guitar at all. And it was just such a mind shattering experience. I hadn't heard of Michael Hedges before that, he was my first exposure to that type of playing, and I was absolutely blown away. I went home and tried to like, emulate that stuff, but I didn't realize he was in Altered Tunings and so just wasn't working at all. And I kind of, gave up on it, you know. but, uh, about a year later I found a VHS instructional cassette on, how to play his tunes, and that was kind of what got me started. So my cousin Richard was really influential for me in getting going with the guitar.

Donny 10:37

When you have the rocky four thing, when you're popping in that cassette and you're listening to it and you're just like, imagining whatever's happening during that experience, what is your deep dive on that? Why do you think. music achieves this connection to our inner core?

Andy 10:53

Oh, man. That's the mystery of it, I think. It's the closest thing to magic, I think, that we really have, I can't explain it, there's a piece for me that is almost impossible to get through without shedding tears the theme from Schindler's List composed by, uh, John Williams. the music is so. Powerful it kills me every time I hear it. So what is it? I mean, it's just like waveform, we're just hearing waves, frequencies, peaks and valleys hitting our eardrum and suddenly we're just overcome. We can't even deal with it. I don't know. I really don't know. But I know why I play music because it's like an outlet for me you know, an hour ago I was playing some guitar and I hadn't played for a few days, and I felt so much better. You know, I, I, I just hadn't picked up a guitar. I'd just been so busy. You pick up the guitar and start playing music and it just, felt so much better. It's an outlet for me and composing pieces, you know, it's a way to say something me, you know, like some sort of emotive thing. And hopefully I can share it with people and if they feel it too, you know, it's just kind of reaffirms this humanity that we all have I think I'm kind of a sensitive person, you know? And, Maybe you have to be, to be an artist, you have to have some sort of sensitivity. And then you can share that through whatever your art is. For me it's music for sure.

Donny 12:04

you mentioned about, vibration I plugged into chat, GPTI if Michael Hedges we're here, and I invite him to the podcast, answer all these questions that I keep on this checklist. And something that I thought was interesting pertaining to what you said, the question is, how do you think music achieves this unique connection to our inner selves? Michael Hedges says, because it's vibration, literally movement, and we're made of vibration. And the source that it put was acoustic guitar in 1994 and, uh, Winham Hill interview notes from 1992. So I said, well, what is it with vibration? Right? And motion like movement.'cause the word emotion, has the word motion in it, where does that even come from? The word I I was given was, it's like verde in Latin. And the translation is to move. And I was like, what was Andy's album called when I discovered him? Art of Motion. The Art of Motion. What was your intention when you said the Art of Motion? Did it have anything to do with that?

Andy 13:21

you got me thinking there just a moment ago whenever we are really affected by something, emotionally we say we are moved. Isn't that right? It's all movement, isn't it? Okay. But the art of motion, actually, I wish there was a really interesting story with that, but I had no idea what to call this piece of music that I had. It became the title of that album. And I was playing at this, festival in Bartlesville, Oklahoma called Sun Fest. And I was playing through my tunes and had played this tune. I said, I have no idea what to call this piece. If anybody out there has an idea, let me know later. This lady came up and she said that, she had a, dance studio called The Art of Motion. Oh, that would be a good name for the tune. I was like, oh, I like that. So

Donny 14:03

the whole idea of emotion movement, and then you're like, what should I call it? And this lady's like, I don't know. Why don't you just do something that makes complete sense to this?

Andy 14:11

Wow. It is crazy. That is weird. It

Donny 14:14

worked out that way. So when you're talking about the Schindler's List example for the, soundtrack to that, are there any other times where you've listened to music or anything that, stands out in particular? When you've cried music related tears.

Andy 14:29

absolutely. Um, I'm prone to that, I guess if there's something really moving. And you know, I, I think the most recent, experience of that for me, was hearing a friend of mine, a guitar player named Trevor Gordon Hall. It's a few years ago now though, but he had this new album come out and it was, the title track from this album called This Beautiful Chaos. I have this guitar, retreat thing I, do every year called Musar. I had him as a guest at it, to be an instructor. We had these concerts in the evening, and he played this piece and I was just, just overcome man. the compositions are one thing, and then there's also the ability of the player to deliver it. He's got both of those things, that's something that's kind of rare. His piece, this beautiful chaos really, really brought me to tears, last time. I heard that. Just so, so powerful. But there's been other times too, with, this solo acoustic guitar stuff, what's so special about it, I think to me is it's just so personal. It's just one person, you know, on a guitar delivering, music and with steel string guitar, you know, you got. so much control there. Your left hand and your right hand, whether you're plucking the strings, whether you have fingernails or flesh. How much of each one, if you're hammering on pulling off, tapping harmonics, you can express, with the acoustic steel string, finger style guitar, when you got a great composition and a great player. Stuff like, let's say Michael Hedges. He had a tune called Ursa Major, that, that tune's really powerful for me to hear. For me, a lot of times it's this kind of genre. That's why I was really drawn to it as well. It's just that real direct personal nature to it.

Donny 15:59

Have you ever, felt A profound, like very moving, maybe spiritual, something that happened while you were either writing or performing, your music?

Andy 16:32

Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Um, there's, A piece of mind called, for my father and, uh, it's a tune I wrote for my dad, obviously. Sadly he passed away, in 2005, from cancer. And so, you know, I'd started to. To get into my whole solo acoustic guitar, timeline before he passed away. I actually wrote that piece before he died, and so I was able to, play it for before he passed away. And, and so it's, you know, it's, it's pretty heavy piece, I guess, and honestly, it's been interesting over the years to come to kind of realize that that's kind of my, more relevant piece I think, than anything else I've ever done. I, I seem to get more people talking about that and telling me, how important that song is to them, than anything else really. But any case, sometimes, I'll play that tune at a show and I'll just get to the end of it and it's, it's tough, you know, still kind of hits me sometimes, if I deliver it, just Right. I did a, version of it actually with, Trevor Gordon Hall and, and another friend, Callen Graham. We have this trio thing, called Triplicity. We released an album last year. we did a, a version of that on there, and it's, like pretty much every time we play that as a trio, it's, yeah, it's really powerful. Hmm.

Donny 17:41

I assumed that it was for your dad, but I didn't know the context I have a guitar that I just leave in that tuning, it's actually the first guitar that I was given by my dad, which is kind of weird. I didn't realize that until, speaking it. I learned it because, my dad passed away. Then my mom got cancer and then she went on hospice. It's really weird that that was like, that was a song. I just, I brought my guitar over. She was in there peacefully. I played that, for her in that room, which is kind of special. So,

Andy 18:11

i'm honored. I'm very honored by that.

Donny 18:14

A big part of this, podcast is, is the whole idea of me trying to put myself in my mom's shoes. In a world where you can't communicate, you can only listen, the voice becomes much more insignificant, we talk a lot about meditation too. We have guests speak on their experiences and, we could, we could talk on that too for your creative process.

Andy 18:39

Yeah, I kind of got into, meditation and, wouldn't necessarily say I'm a Buddhist, but I got into, reading philosophy and, some books on Buddhism, when my grandfather had passed away and kind of started looking at different religions and things like that. I haven't done it enough in, in more recent years, it can definitely help, calm down especially in these, in these, these days, man, it's. Seems pretty, uh, chaotic and pretty hectic, now more than ever with, doom scrolling. I think, Gosh, I'm almost starting to get into that. It seems like it's like on Instagram or wherever, you're just flipping through and it's like, what am I doing? I'm wasting time here.

Donny 19:12

Meditation for 10 minutes takes forever. 10 minutes is forever. But then I'm like, there's no way. I was on my phone for three hours today. There's no way. You know what I'm saying? It does not make sense. But there's a theory that meditation sort of taps you into this, world. The guy from the White Stripes had an interview, and he's like, yeah, I'm a receiver, like a radio receiver almost. And he's like, these waveforms are being transmitted through the universe, and he doesn't consider his songs, his songs. He's like, I'm just receiving them, they came from some source and I'm just the guy that pulls them in and, records it, I'm really interested when you're writing and creating, what are your thoughts there? Where does it come from?

Andy 19:55

Yeah. Actually there's sort of a, Buddhist philosophy that, the ideal state of mind is to have a beginner's mind rather than, feeling like you're an expert or a professional, at something, because you have more, freedom maybe, and you're more open to possibility. Without even deciding that was gonna be my approach. That kind of is my approach to guitar with these altered tunings. When you start throwing your guitar into these bizarre tunings and you got different intervals on each string, all of the chord shapes that you've known your whole life are just gone. Anything, you've memorized you just can't rely on'em anymore. So, that's probably counterintuitive to just about every guitar player, and it certainly isn't conducive to sitting down and jamming with people. If, you sit down with a bunch of people and you got some guitar in this bizarro tuning, I don't know how to jam, you know, if my guitar isn't c minor, ninth tuning, I can't sit down and jam, at all. But I like the exploration, it's like you've got a whole new. Palette, or a new world, to explore here when you got this, alternate tuning. So that's always been my approach, with finger style guitar is, trying new tunings and see what sort of chord voicings you can find and, go from there. You know, maybe come up with some cool chord progression or some rhythmic idea and maybe you'll start to hear some melodic ideas. That's how I've always came up with stuff. Yeah. But does it

Donny 21:19

sound cool or does it, feel a certain way?

Andy 21:22

I mean, yeah, I guess not all of my tunes are written in just one, sort of. Idea, I guess, of, of, all right, this tune needs to be, highly melodic, or this tune needs to be a percussive guitar piece, or this tune needs to be this sort of textural, you know, I like to do it all kind of, so, you know, I have pieces like Ry Lynn or for my father, which are really melodic. But then maybe something more like Sam's Star Drive or NOC turn where it's like this really textural kind of piece, ambient, almost, or, you know, drifting or Hunter's Moon. You've got a lot of percussive stuff. It just depends on kind of what I want to do with the guitar, you know, with that piece, I guess. You know, I, I think it was Jack White, you were saying that maybe he's like a radio antenna I feel like there's some truth to that.'cause I don't know where these things come from. I'm just kind of playing and then hearing something I want to do. What am I hearing? Where is that coming from? I don't know. It's like these, these sequences of notes and rhythms are already existing in the universe and I'm a filter, you know, or I. Putting things together in some way. Maybe each artist is a filter for music, you know, and their personality, their decision making is what's making it happen. almost feels like you're discovering it rather than creating it

Donny 22:42

I felt like this podcast, never started with meditation, but meditation became such a conversation because that's how we tap into that world. Whatever that is, wherever these things are that are floating these ideas, we're able to tap into that by tuning out of all the distraction, Is there like any music or an artist that constantly appears in your life?

Andy 23:04

I don't know if there's anything that's like odd, that I would be like, oh yeah, this kind of incidentally, strangely keeps popping up, do

Donny 23:10

you Shazam at

Andy 23:11

all? I don't actually. I, I've got a pretty good, vocabulary of like, actually, what was it, two days ago, my, uh, wife pulled up on YouTube. She found this video. It was like the number one song from like 19. 58 or something through 2024, and I got all of them right up until about 2006, and then I kind of dropped off so you're

Donny 23:34

the music trivia guy. Maybe that's why your sister was taking you to the bars trivia. Was it also trivia night?

Andy 23:42

Yeah, man, I've got a pretty good, memory on tunes, even if it's not a band I might like or something, but if, if it's Yeah. Something that I've heard, it's like, oh yeah, that was boom. So, you know. But anyway, music that I just can't seem to get tired of and an artist that I just have not gotten tired of is Michael Hedges. I just can listen to him any day. His music still relevant to me and interesting to me. I listen to it and I still find character and depth to it. That's just mind boggling and it blows me away still. He'll probably be with me till till I'm gone, so.

Donny 24:15

Well, you know what's interesting is that, the way, music can transcend time. My generation. You became, our Michael Hedges the way I perceive it. Not to compare apples to oranges but I mean, Michael Hedges to you is, I think you, to us, maybe through you, his legacy continues.'cause I would not have listened through Michael Hedges if it weren't for me discovering you first.

Andy 24:43

That's been an important, very important to me, you know, uh, ever since my career took off, to make sure that people knew about the artists that I love, especially with this sort of niche genre, you know? If this is your first experience here in finger style guitar, you gotta know about all the guys that came before me. So it's, you know, I, I've got some shows coming up next month and I'll do a few songs from all those guys in my show just to make sure people know about'em and get to hear that music live. Sometimes there's still fans out there that, you know, it's their opportunity to hear that stuff live again. So,

Donny 25:13

I also had another question, which is what would the ultimate episode of, the Music Ghost Stories podcast be for someone like yourself?

Andy 25:21

Oh man. If there was any way to ever talk to Michael Hedges if he were still alive, He's, definitely my biggest influence, you know? And, and still find inspiration through his music. So, um, actually another really incredible guitar player for me is Pierre Ben. Suzanne. He's a, a French guitarist, a instrumental acoustic guitar player, and, his expressiveness with the guitar is just so other worldly almost. It's incredible.

Donny 25:45

This conversation was great. Andy, thanks for taking the time.

Andy 25:48

thank you, Donnie. This was great for me too, it means a lot to me to hear stories like Your Man and how my music has meant so much to people. So thanks, man.

Donny 25:56

Keep going.

Andy 25:56

I'll keep going. You can count on it. Thanks, Donnie. You take care. All

Donny 25:59

right.

Andy 26:00

See you, bye-Bye.

26:02

Andy McKee came into my life through a screen, but what stayed with me wasn't the algorithm. It was a song called"For My Father." I learned it after the passing of my dad, played it for my mom while she was on hospice, and then again with my first newborn son while he was sleeping between my chest and the guitar. That's what music does. It shows up almost right when you need it, and it becomes part of your story. Andy talked about vibration, about emotion being movement, about not knowing where the music even comes from, only that it arrives. He talked about the beginner's mind, about altered tunings that strip away everything you think you know and force you to listen again almost to discover instead of to create. And maybe that's an invitation for all of us to stay open, to keep listening, to have that mindset, to let music find you in the places that you least expect it. All right. Thank you all again for being here and for listening to this episode. If this episode stayed with you, please leave a review wherever you are. Drop five stars if you're on Apple Podcasts, if you're on Spotify, and it will help us reach more listeners and get more people to listen intently. And don't miss out. Be sure to subscribe so you can listen to more episodes as they come along. All right, everyone. This is Music Ghost Stories. Keep listening.